a)What were the costs and benefits of the industrial transformation of the post-Civil War era?
b)Should industrialists like Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller be viewed as “robber barons” or “captains of industry”?
c)Was the growing class division of the time a threat to American democracy? Why or Why not?
d)Does the government regulation of the economy disprove the belief that capitalism is a morally superior economic theory? Why or why not?
25 comments:
The industrial revolution offered opprotunities for many uneducated Americans and European and Chinese immigrants, and helped to rebuild the South's economy after the destruction of theirs land and main commodities after the Civil War. It caused problems because it helped to widened the gap between classes and caused many injuries and problems like long work days and poor pay. The failed attempts and unionizing because of immigrant workers caused hostility and xenophobia between workers
The Industrial Revolution did offer opportunities for Americans and immigrants, but it also opened the window for corruption to take place. This time period allowed big companies to believe that they were over the law and showed that money could buy a place within the government. Also, this revolution created a large gap within the social structure, the rich became richer and the poor became poorer. This may have been a good time for America's working class and immigrants, but it was also a very bad time politics wise. Bribery, money, and returning favors was the key motivation of this era known as, the Era of Returning Favors.
industrialists like Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller be viewed as “robber barons” because they selfishly sought success rather than helping the growth of the U.S. They lowered wages for non valid reasons (to make steel more affordable), currupted the government( did not serve and protect the people but instead harmed them even worse) and put money towards buildings rather than people. These men definetly abused the power and authority. They caused a huge gap in social classes and took advantage of their workers trust to help themselves and their personal interest, not the business interest. Overall they were ruthless and conniving men who only priority was mass money making.
I agree with Naiah when she said, "industrialists like Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller can be viewed as “robber barons” because they selfishly sought success rather than helping the growth of the U.S." But even though they were seen as selfishly inclined, they helped America prosper in the long run by creating challenging work rules and laws that hamper business today. Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller were responsible for major industrialization of the U.S. which is why they can be also viewed as "captains of industry" Yes, I know that the conditions for their workers were tough and many lives were lost, but it helped America realize things need to change, Just like the Civil War, many was loss but lots were positive gains in return. That is what history is about and that is why people like Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller are important even though they abused their powers, should be seen as “captains of industry” because America could not have prospered without them in the long run.
I agree with Tanisha. During this time a large social and economic gap increased in one of the sources in the DBQ on pg.A116 Henry states "the gulf between the employed and the employer is growing wider; social contrasts are becoming sharper; as liveried carriages appear; so do barefoot children" The industrial boom also brought simpler alternatives to everyday life, such as oil, coal and steel which where used to on railroads, and in homes.
I agree with Leniece linder that the time period offered opprotunities for the uneducated. Because of industrialist like Carnegie, he provided funds for schools and universities to thrive and become successful. Also he and others sparked an "industial boom." Unfortunately for industrialist like Carnegie and Rockefeller, the economy became corrupt. From favors to stealing money from the poor, the nation suffered as it could not grow economically because capitalist were taking out money for selfish nedds and only making the wealthier more wealthy.
I agree that the growing class division within America during this time era created an issue in our democracy, because the labor workers were being treated unfairly. For example individuals of the working class began working more hours for less pay, and they were being replaced by unskilled workers. They faced dangerous tasks each day in places such as the steel industry. Also their bathroom and lunch breaks were limited. These conditions of which they were forced to work under is what seperates them from the wealthier citizens of America.
Although industrialists such as Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller expoilted their workers I wouldn't say that they should be considered as "robber barons" because they each helped American develope on it's path towards modernization. Yes, their methods were unpleasent but they had respectable reasons for them. And they also compensated for this fault by contributing money to different charities. (Spirit,pg.61)J D Rockefeller " yearly donated one-tenth of his income to charities"(Spirit, pg.66)and Carniege was " givinig his fortune away... He gambled everything on the future prosperty of the United States". I see each of them as "captains of the industry" because they did what was necessary to become exceedingly profitable and powerful in the industrial world. The only "robber barons" in this situation were those who allowed these industries to gain control in politics.
I agree with Naiah that Vanderbilt, Carnegie, and Rockefellershould be viewed as "robber barons" because they only wanted success for themselves instead of their country. The positive side of their selfiness is if it weren't for their ideas, America's economic domination wouldn't be success as it is today.
I agree with Morgan. I wouldn't consider them "robber barons" because even though their wealth widened the gap between the rich and poor, the argument that these men were more like the leaders of a growing industry is even more valid. As Morgan stated, they did help America develop towards modernization. If these men did not transfer their wealth towards educational development, there would have been no means for industrial development. And if America’s industry could not develop, it would never have risen to excellence.
I love these comments. You're really catching the complexity of this argument... I think the class is split between future monopolists and future social justice advocates.
I also agree with Tanisha. The Industrial Age was good for America as a whole by creating jobs, but it caused appalling behavior to happen in organizations such as the government, which is suppose to protect you. Also the age oppressed the poorer class because they were constantly being let go of jobs. Therefore the poorer class was dependent on the wealthy class.
I agree with Morgan because also capitalists like Carnegie and Rockefeller monopolized their industries, they made a great contribution to modern industry. Both steel and oil changed the way Americans used electricity, powered vehicles and built cities. Carnegie and Rockefeller were captains of the industry because without their contributions and transformations, America would not have developed as quickly or as efficiently as it did. Imagine America without fuel for cars and still making houses with flimsy wood foundations.
i agree with naiah and cynthia. If we look at the capitalists like Carnegie and Rockefeller from one point of view, "captains of industry" would be a suitable name, but if we look at it in another way, "robber barons" would be a more appropriate way to portray them as. Those who agree that they should be considered "robber barons" see the corrupt in the way Carnegie and Rockefeller ran their businesses in the industry. The men were only concerned with money and did selfish things for their own personal gain. "They abused their power and authority." They took advantage of the still young economy of our industrialized society. It seems like they were taking more than they were giving. The working conditions for their workers were dangerous and not suitable for a working environment. Instead of putting money into repairs and paying their workers the wages they worked for, the mercenary men put that money towards other exclusive projects.
It also makes sense to call these men “captains of industry.” Though they did corrupt things with their power and money, they are responsible for placing the stepping stones for the change that an industrialized America would soon be experiencing. If we look past the tainted and unethical works of Carnegie and Rockefeller, we see that these men are actually the reason why American industries are the way they are.
a.) The outcomes and effects on America after the Civil War were both beneficial and tragic. The Civil War was finally over, but after it ended, it left behind heavy concerns. Many Americans lost their lives in this war. It was hard to believe that the people that were supposed to be a united nation were fighting and killing each other. The death toll from the civil war were in the hundred millions.
The financial status of America was in danger due to the millions of dollars that the civil war cost the Americans, both the union and confederacy. Because the war was mainly fought in the south, there was a lot of damage done to land and property that the confederates had to worry about.
With the end of the war also came some light. Slavery was finally abolished and blacks every where were free.
I agree with Essence, but although they made great and significance impacts on industry and life as we know it, they were becoming filthy rich while their laborers were barely recieving pennies for their work. People were dying from the harsh working conditions and basically giving their lives for the benefit of these industrial moguls. So these men can be considered robber barrons because not only are they taking all of the money but all of the labor is robbing people of their lives.
Comments are brilliant and I like how your talking across classes, that's kinda cool...
People like Carnegie, Vanderbilt and Rockefeller were not robber barons. Take a good look at the nature of the complex society forming. Some used Social Darwinism to justify the great disparities. Others blamed the economic complexity of supply and demand. That the more demand for supplies, the more production, meaning more workers. Thus the more production increases, the more impoverished workers became.
Truth is that everyone had an equal opportunity to focus on acquiring skills/ their specialty so that they didn’t become part of the subordinate party (lower class). One cannot blame or condemn these economic leaders for utilizing opportunities.
Now in regards to present day, I do not feel this way. Times have changed and what was once complexity is now a labyrinth to justice. Today people are deprived or equal opportunities to excel within the economic and societal institutions. Obama has been trying his best to fight oppressors who walk upon the middle and lower class. Thus trying to prevent the abuse of capitalism and the power of wealth that it provides.
Was it equal opportunity? The racial and ethnic makeup of society is also complexifying...
Industrialists like Vanderbilt, Carnegie and Rockefeller can be viewed as "captains of the industry." Without their efforts and contributions, America wouldn't have the road towards modernization and become a leader in it. Although they did reap many benefits, America needed the wealth and power of these men to prosper.
I agree with what Naiah said. It's true that the industrialists did help America become modern, but they taxed many people to do so. They taxed farmers and gained their trust only in the end to lose that trust. For example the Oat Meal Trust,was a trust stating that the mills should stay idle but it instead closed down. This resulted to laborers losing their jobs and time. How could people trust these industrialists after this event?
The civil war started following the election of Abraham Lincoln who along with his party was committed to the thought of free labor.The cost of the war was dangerous with the country in debt and millions of lives loss.Billions of property damage to the confederate states, resulting in a crash down of the economy. Abraham Lincoln was also assassinated which was a set back for the country. The civil war ruined the souths economy increased the northern capital to grow.
I would consider them "robber barons" because they created an system that continued to make the rich,more rich even though they don't need the money like the opposing side of the economy which comes from the working class.I agree with Leniece because the industrial revolution did provide more jobs for uneducated Americans,but it also provided an broad horizon for Americans to work in unsafe and unclean working conditions.This caused multiple incidents where workers were exposed to injuries and a straight forward working force as far as working for like 16 hours a day just to provide for families alone.
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